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Quiet engines a "breach of contract"
04-09-2014, 09:14 AM
Post: #51
RE: Quiet engines a "breach of contract"
F1 introduces major changes to become greener and then forget noise pollution is a major issue on ecosystems today.
Other possibility is to embed one in each car:



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05-17-2014, 10:55 AM
Post: #52
RE: Quiet engines a "breach of contract"
Australian Grand Prix boss Ron Walker is confident pressure from race organisers all over the world will force formula one authorities to accelerate efforts to make this year’s new-generation cars sound better. Walker has led the push by F1 race promoters for noisier engines.

http://www.smh.com.au/sport/motorsport/r...z31ysnhuEU

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05-20-2014, 09:02 AM
Post: #53
RE: Quiet engines a "breach of contract"
(05-17-2014 10:55 AM)Neonzapper Wrote:  Australian Grand Prix boss Ron Walker is confident pressure from race organisers all over the world will force formula one authorities to accelerate efforts to make this year’s new-generation cars sound better. Walker has led the push by F1 race promoters for noisier engines.

http://www.smh.com.au/sport/motorsport/r...z31ysnhuEU

He actually says "the people in the stands don't understand the regulations". Does he think the level of fan who pays hundreds of dollars to see a race doesn't know the rules enough to get the hybrid systems? It isn't casual fans in the stands.

The things he's talking about the fans wanting to see like aggression and a gladitorial contest are about the racing, not the noise level, and Mercedes aside we are getting them. In terms of noise he also just seems to be talking about volume, I don't think the teams are going to make significantly more volume without giving away efficiency, so that's never going to happen, the era of cars being at those sort of volumes is over.

Seeing his picture highlights one thing for me, F1 is still being run by a bunch of really old traditionalists. Isn't it about time they got some young blood in? F1 needs to pull the young affluent Gen Y/Z groups into the sport that can afford to attend races and buy the products the sponsors are selling.
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05-20-2014, 10:57 PM (This post was last modified: 06-13-2014 06:07 PM by Neonzapper.)
Post: #54
RE: Quiet engines a "breach of contract"
Clark made a great point in the latest podcast. If everyone's complaining about F1 noise this year, what are they going to say about Formula E?

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05-21-2014, 09:35 AM
Post: #55
RE: Quiet engines a "breach of contract"
(05-20-2014 10:57 PM)Neonzapper Wrote:  Clark made a great point in the latest podcast. If everyone's complaining about F1 noise this year, what are they going to say about Formua E?

The people who complain about noise probably won't watch it as they'll think it's blasphemy not to be burning hydrocarbons. Those that are interested won't care.

Don't think it's everyone complaining about F1 noise, the vocal minority always seem bigger than they really are.
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10-02-2015, 06:56 PM
Post: #56
RE: Quiet engines a "breach of contract"
The F.I.A. is standing firm on adding F1 car noise for 2016. The ruling adds a separate tail pipe which actually serves a purpose as the turbo waste gate for exhaust gases. The noise results as these gases are routed directly to atmosphere rather than being re-routed as the current power units do.

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10-02-2015, 07:11 PM
Post: #57
RE: Quiet engines a "breach of contract"
i really don't know what to do with people who think that the quietness of f1 cars is a problem that needs to be addressed. my instinct is to have them involuntarily committed to a mental institution, but then i realize they must be living in such a perfect world of gumdrops and rainbows for that to be the issue they take up, so i'm not sure we should disrupt that. maybe just pat them on the head and say "bless your heart" like a condescending southerner, then do nothing to make f1 cars louder?
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10-02-2015, 09:53 PM (This post was last modified: 10-02-2015 09:58 PM by leonbray.)
Post: #58
RE: Quiet engines a "breach of contract"
(10-02-2015 07:11 PM)frankdouglason Wrote:  i really don't know what to do with people who think that the quietness of f1 cars is a problem that needs to be addressed. my instinct is to have them involuntarily committed to a mental institution, but then i realize they must be living in such a perfect world of gumdrops and rainbows for that to be the issue they take up, so i'm not sure we should disrupt that. maybe just pat them on the head and say "bless your heart" like a condescending southerner, then do nothing to make f1 cars louder?

spoken like a young fella with very little experience of real F1 cars .... I remember back in the days of the Tasman series, when the high revving V8 and V12s sounded so good .... oh well time to get in the Camry and go and pick up my medication

(10-02-2015 06:56 PM)Neonzapper Wrote:  The F.I.A. is standing firm on adding F1 car noise for 2016. The ruling adds a separate tail pipe which actually serves a purpose as the turbo waste gate for exhaust gases. The noise results as these gases are routed directly to atmosphere rather than being re-routed as the current power units do.

I think they are trying to appeal to a younger demographic who like to hear the blow off valve woosh when they change gear

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10-03-2015, 12:17 AM
Post: #59
RE: Quiet engines a "breach of contract"
(10-02-2015 09:53 PM)leonbray Wrote:  real F1 cars

i challenge you to explain what that means without implying that the era of f1 that you first watched was magically superior.
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10-03-2015, 12:49 AM (This post was last modified: 10-03-2015 12:50 AM by leonbray.)
Post: #60
RE: Quiet engines a "breach of contract"
(10-03-2015 12:17 AM)frankdouglason Wrote:  
(10-02-2015 09:53 PM)leonbray Wrote:  real F1 cars

i challenge you to explain what that means without implying that the era of f1 that you first watched was magically superior.

an era where F1 cars were superior to other racing marques, were not inhibited by oppressive regulation, where distinct engine variations made different noise, where differing aero approaches led to differing body styles and creativity was valued

Today all you have are spec cars that are, in some cases, not as fast as cars from lower categories or other series. They all look the same (apart from colour) and they all sound the same.

... and the new regulations aren't going to change things as the powers that be are defining, in detail, the shape and size of wings and even the angles of the barge boards

If you buy and build a number of Tamiya 1/20th scale F1 cars from the same era you will see how widely they varied in style and configuration

All subjective and opinion from one of the old farts

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10-03-2015, 03:52 AM
Post: #61
RE: Quiet engines a "breach of contract"
when did engine variations stop making different noise? i'm just looking for a rough estimate of when the engines started sounding the same to you.

(10-03-2015 12:49 AM)leonbray Wrote:  creativity was valued

that means never. f1 cars were never designed by artists trying to be creative. it was always engineers trying to go faster. while there was certainly creativity involved, it wasn't valued, just a necessary means to the end goal of performance.
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10-03-2015, 08:19 AM
Post: #62
RE: Quiet engines a "breach of contract"
(10-03-2015 03:52 AM)frankdouglason Wrote:  when did engine variations stop making different noise? i'm just looking for a rough estimate of when the engines started sounding the same to you.

(10-03-2015 12:49 AM)leonbray Wrote:  creativity was valued

that means never. f1 cars were never designed by artists trying to be creative. it was always engineers trying to go faster. while there was certainly creativity involved, it wasn't valued, just a necessary means to the end goal of performance.

Engines stopped making different noises when they went to V10s and the engine revs climbed to 18,000 - then it became a similar high pitched scream

My father-in-law was one of the guys that built a certain Australian world champions sprint car engines. His creativity in developing a new engine design and those of other engineers they worked with was certainly valued, even with the goal of going faster.

I would also suggest that Frank Costin, Colin Chapman, Bruce McLaren, Adrian Newey were some of the engineers whose creativity was valued ... and who were as much an artist as they were engineers making cars run faster

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10-03-2015, 11:36 AM (This post was last modified: 10-03-2015 11:38 AM by Miguel.)
Post: #63
RE: Quiet engines a "breach of contract"
(10-02-2015 07:11 PM)frankdouglason Wrote:  i really don't know what to do with people who think that the quietness of f1 cars is a problem that needs to be addressed. my instinct is to have them involuntarily committed to a mental institution, but then i realize they must be living in such a perfect world of gumdrops and rainbows for that to be the issue they take up, so i'm not sure we should disrupt that. maybe just pat them on the head and say "bless your heart" like a condescending southerner, then do nothing to make f1 cars louder?

I couldn't agree more... and I'm an old fella with extensive experience of proper F1 cars and engines (i.e. Cosworth V8, Matra V12, Ferrari 12 - Flats and boxers, and no that's not the same thing - etc)

(10-03-2015 12:49 AM)leonbray Wrote:  Today all you have are spec cars that are, in some cases, not as fast as cars from lower categories or other series

you really shouldn't be dragging McLaren into the discussion.

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10-05-2015, 11:31 AM
Post: #64
RE: Quiet engines a "breach of contract"
Didn't 99% of people stop moaning about the noise 6 months ago? I thought it all died down a long time ago once everyone got used to the new sound.

I thought I'd seen some comparison of F1 cars to previous, recent, era's that showed they were actually as quick, or thereabouts, now. So the slower than GP2 comments are nonsense now. Perhaps a Manor is in that region, but most teams are significantly faster than them, and comparing the slowest F1 car to the fastest GP2 car is silly. Not to mention the GP2 car is a fully resolved spec car, v's a ground up prototype in a new technological era. It's not supposed to be easy to get it right.
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10-05-2015, 12:28 PM
Post: #65
RE: Quiet engines a "breach of contract"
(10-05-2015 11:31 AM)chemics Wrote:  Didn't 99% of people stop moaning about the noise 6 months ago?

18 months ago. For the record I never complained, I do wish they were slightly louder but I do not miss the model aircraft sounding engines we left behind.

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11-28-2015, 09:35 AM (This post was last modified: 11-28-2015 09:39 AM by Neonzapper.)
Post: #66
RE: Quiet engines a "breach of contract"
Hydrogen fuel velocity mixture coupled with oxygen may be the key to 2016 F1 sound solution...






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