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rule 30.13
09-15-2011, 02:11 AM
Post: #1
rule 30.13
30.13 At no time may a car be driven unnecessarily slowly, erratically or in a manner which could be deemed potentially dangerous to other drivers or any other person. This will apply whether any such car is being driven on the track, the pit entry or the pit lane.

my emphasis added.

perhaps the race director should address the issue of tire warming behind the safety car. certainly looks erratic to me.
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09-15-2011, 08:56 AM
Post: #2
RE: rule 30.13
To be classed as erratic doesn't it really need to be beyond normally expected behaviour rather than something that everyone does and is expected to do?

Although by that token Schumacher should be OK to punt people off when they try and overtake him now he's been doing it for 20 years Smile
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09-15-2011, 09:43 AM
Post: #3
RE: rule 30.13
erratic [ɪˈrætɪk]
adj
1. irregular in performance, behaviour, or attitude; inconsistent and unpredictable


His driving was entirely regular, consistent and predictable. After all he did it for about 5 laps in a row, how regular, consistent and predictable do you want?

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09-15-2011, 12:27 PM
Post: #4
RE: rule 30.13
it's an excellent argument, chaps.
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09-15-2011, 12:39 PM
Post: #5
RE: rule 30.13
Hey Chemics, did we just win an argument with Frank, in one hit???

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09-15-2011, 12:59 PM (This post was last modified: 09-15-2011 01:01 PM by frankdouglason.)
Post: #6
RE: rule 30.13
no.

but it's an excellent argument.
should a driver who chooses to drive the racing line without the swerving behind the safety car be considered to be driving erratically?
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09-15-2011, 02:07 PM
Post: #7
RE: rule 30.13
(09-15-2011 12:39 PM)Yaaay Wrote:  Hey Chemics, did we just win an argument with Frank, in one hit???

Let's say yes, as a lawyer he will never admit it anyway.
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09-15-2011, 02:11 PM
Post: #8
RE: rule 30.13
i'm not on retainer here. i can admit anything i want.

i'm amused by the thought that the frenetic swerving would be considered not erratic, but unconvinced.
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09-15-2011, 02:11 PM
Post: #9
RE: rule 30.13
(09-15-2011 12:59 PM)frankdouglason Wrote:  should a driver who chooses to drive the racing line without the swerving behind the safety car be considered to be driving erratically?

No, nor would it be erratic to swerve to heat their tyres or accelerate and brake to heat their brakes. It's normal and expected.

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09-15-2011, 02:14 PM (This post was last modified: 09-15-2011 02:14 PM by chemics.)
Post: #10
RE: rule 30.13
(09-15-2011 12:59 PM)frankdouglason Wrote:  should a driver who chooses to drive the racing line without the swerving behind the safety car be considered to be driving erratically?

Arguably yes, but I think they would just be classes as stupid and get overtaken on the restart.
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09-16-2011, 03:37 AM
Post: #11
RE: rule 30.13
Well done, Frank. Like moths to a flame!
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09-16-2011, 04:17 AM
Post: #12
RE: rule 30.13
nah, i'm not trying to stir up anything. i was reading the regs (yeah, for fun, move along) and thought that was funny so i posted it here for a laugh. then i received the argument that frantic swerving was the opposite of erratic driving, and was amused by the creativity of it.

it's all way too frivolous to really care about.
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09-16-2011, 05:01 AM
Post: #13
RE: rule 30.13
friv·o·lous    [friv-uh-luhs]
adjective
1. characterized by lack of seriousness or sense:


I don't think so.

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09-16-2011, 12:54 PM
Post: #14
RE: rule 30.13
I can't believe that such an important rule can be so vague. Any driver could argue that their move is not unpredictable.

Here is a video of the incident:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DzvXwXp01MM

"Many people ask me why I always sign off 'Till we meet again.' Because goodbye is always so final. Goodbye, Dan Wheldon." - Marty Reid
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09-16-2011, 01:02 PM
Post: #15
RE: rule 30.13
(09-16-2011 12:54 PM)C_O_N Wrote:  I can't believe that such an important rule can be so vague.

if it was clear there would be nothing for us to blame the stewards over.
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09-16-2011, 04:22 PM
Post: #16
RE: rule 30.13
(09-16-2011 12:54 PM)C_O_N Wrote:  Here is a video of the incident:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DzvXwXp01MM

Jenson is good, isn't he.

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09-16-2011, 04:31 PM
Post: #17
RE: rule 30.13
(09-16-2011 04:22 PM)Yaaay Wrote:  
(09-16-2011 12:54 PM)C_O_N Wrote:  Here is a video of the incident:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DzvXwXp01MM

Jenson is good, isn't he.

He seems to be getting the upper hand on Hamilton more recently. It will be interesting to see what happens next year if he carries this form on.
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09-16-2011, 08:05 PM
Post: #18
RE: rule 30.13
(09-16-2011 04:31 PM)chemics Wrote:  He seems to be getting the upper hand on Hamilton more recently. It will be interesting to see what happens next year if he carries this form on.

Even more intersting if McLaren give them a good car.

Regards,
Mark

"A man who took simple pleasure in making things work properly"
[Nigel Roebuck, writing of Bruce McLaren]

"Bruce McLaren was the best person I ever worked for. He was amazing"
[Howden Ganley, 12th September 2009]
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09-16-2011, 08:13 PM
Post: #19
RE: rule 30.13
lewis is a "win or die trying" driver. jenson is a "let the car do what it can do" driver.

a dominant car favors jenson.
a competitive car favors lewis.
an almost competitive car is a toss-up.
a mid-field car favors jenson.
a back-marker car favors lewis.
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09-16-2011, 08:52 PM
Post: #20
RE: rule 30.13
(09-16-2011 08:05 PM)drmarkf Wrote:  Even more intersting if McLaren give them a good car.

They have a good car. I've read analysis and beleive they actually had the best car at Spa and Monza and it looked like it. They didn't act like like winning team though. In these cases Jenson comes out much much better than Lewis.

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09-17-2011, 04:58 AM
Post: #21
RE: rule 30.13
(09-16-2011 08:13 PM)frankdouglason Wrote:  a dominant car favors jenson.
a competitive car favors lewis.
an almost competitive car is a toss-up.
a mid-field car favors jenson.
a back-marker car favors lewis.

So shouldn't Lewis be in front then? Or don't you think their current car is competitive? It's certainly not dominant.
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09-17-2011, 05:15 AM
Post: #22
RE: rule 30.13
mclaren is in the "almost competitive" class in my book this year. red bull is "dominant," therefor nobody can be "competitive."
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09-17-2011, 06:08 AM
Post: #23
RE: rule 30.13
I'd say RBR was dominant at the start of the season, but now it's not any more. Now (and since Germany) RBR and McLaren are both competitive, not sure if Ferrari is quite there or just 'almost competitive'.
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09-17-2011, 06:44 AM
Post: #24
RE: rule 30.13
(09-16-2011 04:17 AM)frankdouglason Wrote:  nah, i'm not trying to stir up anything.

Although I might have been taking a (friendly!) jab at someone, it wasn't you. ;^>
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09-17-2011, 09:48 AM
Post: #25
RE: rule 30.13
(09-17-2011 06:08 AM)InterRaptor Wrote:  I'd say RBR was dominant at the start of the season, but now it's not any more. Now (and since Germany) RBR and McLaren are both competitive, not sure if Ferrari is quite there or just 'almost competitive'.

Before Monza I would have agreed, but now I think that RBR are pulling out the gap again.

"Many people ask me why I always sign off 'Till we meet again.' Because goodbye is always so final. Goodbye, Dan Wheldon." - Marty Reid
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